Separation Anxiety & "Carpet No-No's" problems

[katatawnic]

Hi, I'm new to the group. I joined because there don't seem to be easily found sites anymore with *good* helpful advice, and I'm in a jam.

Long story (sorry, my first email here!).... I have a Dauschound (sp?) mix, Sadie, that my mom gave to me. She's a sweetie and I love her to bits. However, my mom didn't do such a great job in training her. I got her when she was 2 (she's almost 3 now), and she's not the smartest cookie in the batch. (LOL) She has major separation anxiety problems, as well as daily "going" on the floor instead of letting us know she needs to go outside. HELP!!!

First of all, I've trained dogs since I was a kid (my dad does it professionally and I learned a lot from working with him). I don't do it professionally, but every dog I've ever had has been "show quality" trained by me, and I've never experienced the problems I'm having now with Sadie. I don't know what else to do with her.

Her separation anxiety was caused directly by my mom.... she was almost constantly locked in her cage/bed with the front door of it attached to the dog door, really only out and about in the house when my mom felt she could fully supervise her. Now, my mom's house floor is entirely tile, so once Sadie was old enough to know to use the dog door, there wasn't much chance for any damage! My mom meant well, she just didn't have the patience to work properly with Sadie, and so of course Sadie now has really bad behaviors/habits ingrained in her, and I want desperately do undo what has been done to her. (As it is, my mom gave her to me because she wasn't home enough, Sadie was lonely, and she wanted Sadie to have a home with us where someone is home a lot and she could have more time and attention, etc. However, I have a feeling that my mom ALSO gave Sadie to me because she didn't want to deal with Sadie's whining and other anxiety issues anymore. Sadie is the third dog in about four years that my mom's had; the other two she only had for a few months, whereas she did keep Sadie for almost two years.)

Anyway, the separation anxiety is bad enough for Sadie herself, and we give her a lot of attention (which we'd do anyway; we also have a Rottie, Sheba, and they both get tons of love and attention from the whole family). But Sadie's so nervous and terrified of being left alone that she whines constantly. (And there is almost ALWAYS someone in the house anyway!) Giving her positive attention for the whining will only reinforce her behavior, but we certainly don't want to resort to shouting or hitting her. So we're at our wits end here. We want her to feel safe and happy enough that she won't whine all the time; we also don't want to go insane from it!


The worse problem, however, is that she is constantly "going" on the floor in the house. We don't have the money right now to finish the fence and install a dog door (which we've always had for our dogs before, but we moved a few months ago and we're still recovering from that expense). However, Sadie has been without a dog door for nearly a year now, and she does know that she is to go outside and not on the floor. Further, Sheba was raised since a young pup with a dog door, and SHE doesn't go in the house; only Sadie.

I'm positive that Sadie's going in the house is MUCH more a behavior problem than a "I can't hold it or understand that I'm supposed to go outside" problem. One, if everyone is in bed with their doors closed, she certainly knows to either whine or scratch at the bedroom doors to let us know that she wants in with us.... yet as soon as she gets the urge to go, she just goes on the floor and doesn't go to the front door to whine or scratch! About a week or so ago, she actually DID go to the front door and whine.... I praised her immensely as I went to the door to let her out. However, she hasn't done this since. And Sadie knows what she is doing is wrong; all you have to do is walk near the spot she went on on the floor and she immediately crouches down and gets that "guilty" look, etc. You don't even have to say a word to her, she already knows that she's busted and that she's done something that is not acceptable.

This is very frustrating to say the least. We're tired of having to scrub the carpets. And I refuse to lock her up in her cage/bed whenever she can't be watched 100% like my mom did, that's no life for any dog! (We still have it, but it's not even assembled; we haven't used it once since we got her from my mom.)

Please, if anyone has any advice as to how I can work on Sadie's behavior problems, OR if anyone knows links to *good* web sites that deal in behavior problems, I would greatly appreciate anything anyone has to offer! I love Sadie, and I'm not one to just give dogs away because there is a problem. I address the issues and work with my dogs. But I've done everything I can think of, and I'm going insane!

Thanks in advance for any advice,
~~ Kat ~~

[Love Bird B]

I'd put down a lot of newspapers for her and hope for the best.

[Squawksx3]

Hi katatawnic and welcome to the board :),

Have you taken her to the vet for a check-up?. Her urinating may be a medical problem...also, he may be able to help out with the separation anxiety problem.

I agree with casegura ... alot of patience, love and understanding.
It sounds like you're frustrated, and your dog can feel your frustrations. Though it may be hard, try being cool and calm when dealing with her. Animals are very keen in picking up on human emotions. Best of luck to you.

[katatawnic]

Thanks for the replies (and for the welcome).

I do feel frustrated, but moreover I'm concerned about Sadie being healthy and happy. It's not a medical problem; her bladder and bowels are in fine condition, the vet has given an A+ checkup. (And she's not just peeing on the floor, it's bowel movements as well.) We make sure that she's let outside very frequently.... yet sometimes within minutes of being let out at night (and watching to make sure she goes outside), she'll go on the floor. Usually in one of the bedrooms, after she's been told "not tonight" in that particular person's bed. (Another symptom of behavior rather than medical problem: "You told me 'no' so I'll show you!" type of thing.)

She's not as whiney as she was when I got her from my mom almost a year ago. I'm sure this is because she has freedom to be around the house, as well as someone almost always being home, and she's cuddled constantly. I know that small breed dogs can be nervous anyway, but this is definitely anxiety. It is improving though, but it's been a long hard road.

It's the excrementing in the house that's so hard to deal with. She knows to go outside, and she does have the control. She does it when she feels she's not getting enough attention.... and she's always getting attention. LOL!

The night I posted this, she once again (for the second time EVER) went to the front door and whined, and I praised her immensely as I said "Let's go outside" and let her out, etc. She was quite pleased with my praise. But, next morning, there was a puddle and a pile on the floor yet again.... less than half an hour after going outside!

She knows what spot(s) she's gone in, and when we walk near the area she crouches immediately, bracing herself for being in trouble. A firm "Sadie, no!" (without even raising the voice) is enough for her to feel "punished" and she goes off to hide for a while. (I don't think she's ever been spanked; not since she moved in with us, anyway.) Every time she goes outside, we praise her and tell her how good she is, etc. Constant work on reinforcing the good behavior and telling her when it's not good.

As I said initially, I've trained dogs all my life. I've never had a problem like this before. I have taken dogs in from others before, and stopped bad habits/behaviors quickly. This is the first time I've come across a problem that I couldn't find a way to address and stop it. Punt kicking her into the creek behind the property is NOT an option :eek: so I don't know what else to do here.

Oh, and I know that our pets can feel our frustrations, they are very empathic. Sometimes I can just TELL that they are talking to me, some people laugh at me but sometimes I have what could be called "conversations" with my dogs.... they feel what I feel, and I can feel what they feel as well. There's a lot of communication between us and our pets. Sadie certainly knows when I'm frustrated with her, but she also knows when I'm happy with her. I just haven't found a way to get her to keep up with the behaviors that make me happy, which in turn make her happy of course. She seems to be one of those that wants any kind of attention, be it positive or negative.... so long as it's attention, you know?

[katatawnic]

casegura, thanks, I never thought about giving no attention at all, including a scolding.

Although the "you can't teach an old dog new tricks" isn't true at all, it's still more difficult; and she is almost three now. That's what's making it even harder, and I know this.

But I'll try that, absolutely no attention for it whatsoever. I'll make sure that she's aware that I know she went in the house, then bring her outside and ignore her for a bit. Maybe she'll start craving the positive attention instead.

[Squawksx3]

I agree.... maybe she's doing the "oopsies" on the floor because she gets attention, even tho its negative. Hopefully in time she will settle down and become a secure and happy dog. Please keep us updated if not giving her attention works.

[katlynweb]

What would happen if you started her all over with crate training like she was a puppy or a new dog? Just an idea. This does appear to be a "behavior and attention seeking" issue as you seem to have had a lot of good experience in the past housebreaking dogs.

[Squawksx3]

You could try it, but if she has separation anxiety, it might do more harm than good. We have a terrier mix in the rescue that is about a year old and he CANNOT be house trained. The owner of the rescue has tried everything. He's still up for adoption, but anyone who asks about him is informed that we can potty train him to be an inside dog.

[Amanda]

I'm just wondering if Sadie was abused before. We adopted a dog from a rescue group when he was only about a year old (he is now 4 yrs old) and he is still not 100% housetrained. We were told by his foster mom that he was abused by his previous owner. He doesn't exhibit any separation anxiety problems but he cannot be crated. He pees in the house, but just like Sadie, he will do it only when we have "forbidden" him from something. For example, if he wants to go to the bathroom with me and I don't let him in, I'm sure to find a puddle on the floor (just outside the bathroom door) when I come out. It's like he's saying, "Well, since you won't let me come in, I'm going to mess up your floor."

Anyway, we have tried everything we can do to housetrain him, but he just won't stop. My husband was getting really mad about all the peeing (and the smell) so I ended up buying a "belly band" from ebay. We put it on him at night and when we are leaving the house. These are the 2 times that he really gets upset with us and pees in the house. Usually, if we let him sleep in the room with us, he will hold it until the morning -- so it's not like he doesn't know how to hold it in.

Just thought I'd tell you about our experience with the same problem. I'm not sure if being abused has anything to do with our dog peeing in the house ... but he's the only dog we got from a rescue group (we have 4 dogs) and he's the only one we have problems with in regards to peeing in the house.

[katatawnic]

Wow, more posts and I didn't realize.... been a tad sick and haven't really been online for a while.

Squak, you answered for me -- I can't put Sadie in a crate, as it's having been constantly locked in her crate before I got her from my mom that created her separation anxiety to begin with. Locking Sadie up would terrorize her, literally.

Amanda, I got Sadie from my mom (who had her since she was weaned), and I would say that yes, at least to an extent Sadie WAS abused. For one thing, the amount of time that she was kept in her crate was extreme, and that in and of itself is abuse, IMO. The ONLY times that she was allowed out of the crate was when my mom could watch her 100%; and she worked full-time and was gone a lot after work and on the weekends. So Sadie was locked up a LOT, to say the least.

Also, my mom yelled (high pitched screams, more like) at Sadie quite a bit. Sadie would be locked up in the crate, and whining to be let out.... my mom would shoot the water bottle at Sadie and scream "NO!" a the top of her lungs repeatedly, and for quite a while. (I was told this by my older son, who lives with my mom for job opportunities, etc.) She just lost all patience with puppies; which is ironic, since I learned all of my patience with puppies/dogs (animals in general) from my mom! I really don't think that my mom hit Sadie, and if she ever did it would have only been light tappings on the rear, as my mom's just not a hitter. Plus, my son would have told me of that too, I'm sure. HOWEVER, Daschounds are known to be a nervous breed in general anyway, and I'm sure that the yelling and constant locking up contributed greatly to Sadie's separation anxiety and whining, not to mention the "carptet no-no's" as that is definitely a behavior problem and not a "can't hold it" problem.


WELL.... there have been improvements. I don't think it's 100% solved yet, but it's lessened a lot. We still haven't gotten permission from the landlord to install a dog door (waiting impatiently for an answer on this one!), but the weather hasn't gotten too cold yet to leave the door open during the day. So, I've been leaving the screen door open during the day as well as the main door, letting Sadie have the freedom to go in and out as she pleases. So as long as she sticks in the yard we let her come and go, and she's very happy with this freedom. Also, whenever we'd let her out ourselves (when the door was closed, of course), we'd say "Wanna go outside?" like usual, and when she'd get excited at the door we'd encourage her to jump up and scratch at the door.... as soon as she'd do this, we'd praise her immensely; we'd do this a couple or few times before letting her out. We were hoping that she'd catch on, that if she'd go to the door and scratch she'd be rewarded with praise and of course being let out. Well, she hasn't caught on to this one.... she just doesn't get that this can be a way of telling us she needs/wants to go out. (Like I originally said, she's not the brightest dog I've known. LOL!)

Anyway.... When we first started all of this "extra" housebreaking stuff a few weeks ago, we would still find surprise piles in my son's room if his door wasn't closed. But this last week there haven't been any unpleasant surprises in his room (her most common place to go), so this is a good sign!

Also, just last night, my fiance and I were watching a movie and Sadie came out of my son's room where she'd been sleeping with him. She got up on the couch with us, but insead of lying down and curling up with us, she kept looking back and forth at us anxiously. So I figured she needed to go out. I was right, she tore off like a lightening bolt as soon as I opened the door.

We're not sure that it's all solved yet, so of course we're still watching her like crazy as if she were a young pup. But, although she has some nervous behaviors, we have started to notice certain ones that indicate she wants/needs to go outside, whereas we used to think she was just acting anxious because she felt the need for attention (as in petting, etc.). Patience and attention is all we have been able to do for Sadie. (Attention in both areas: petting/cuddling as well as focusing on different behaviors that might indicate what she wants or needs.)

She's always gotten tons of attention from us, so that's nothing new. ;) We've just been more aware of different *kinds* of whines or looks that she gives us. (It's more looks than whines when she needs to go outside though, so we have to really observe her expressions and body language.)



Thanks so much, everyone, for the helpful posts! It helps to know that I'm not alone with something like this, and I've gotten some good advice here as well. I've never had a dog this difficult to train before, and I was practically beating my head against the wall before I found this site! I know that more than anything Sadie needs extra love and attention, but of course technique helps immensely, and since I've never had a hard-to-train dog before I've of course never been this stuck. But like I said, things are looking up, and we're just hoping now that Sadie's finally getting it.... that she'll get MORE attention for doing the "right" thing than the "wrong" thing.


~~ Kat ~~