Ol Roy

[Eve_Ogrod]

I've been feeding Ronnie Ol Roy puppy food because my hubby feeds Kezie Ol Roy and it's a less expensive food, but I'm wondering if it's a good quality food. I wasn't too worried when he wasn't hungry, but now he's eating four bowls (plus) of food a day and I don't want him to be unhealthy. Yes, four bowls is a lot and I know that sounds funny, but he is underweight and the vet wants me to fatten him up. I also learned that mixed breed pups need twice the calories of a full grown dog...Any advice?
Thanks!
Eve


Mother to:
Ronnie = Hound mix
Kezie = Husky/Border collie
Mittens = Cat
Dog, Marshall, and Gopher = Mini Lops
Little Bear = Teddy Bear hamster

[Wodkasibs]

I wouldn't feed that food to any of my rescue dogs. Awhile back there was an artical on that stuff. It was killing dogs, wasn't cooked are bake right.
The husky mix isn't getting the fat or protein in that stuff. Its mostly cereal and corn. Your puppy is a large size puppy and needs to be on a high grade puppy food. I do rescue of all ages. This is my opion.

[Eve_Ogrod]

What type of food would you recommend? I need to go to Petco today anyway (he's better and needs socialization), I can pick up some good stuff for him. I am on a budget, so hopefully it's not TOO expensive. :) Not that they're not worth it, but the rabbits have needs, too. ;) Thank you for letting me know! My momther-in-law gives it to her dogs, too, so she was grateful as well.
Have a great day!
Eve

[hopeful]

I feed my dog alpo dry food, he's 5 yrs old and his teeth are so shiny and white :)

[krazy4birds]

Eve, I would recommend you call your local vet and ask him/her their opinion of Ol Roy.
I know of several people who use it and they appear to have healthy dogs. I do not have a dog anymore but if I did I would check out any brand I was concidering with my vet first. Good luck to you!

[Wolat]

old roy is not a good quality pet food. you end up feeding so much that over all you spend more on it than if you bought a good quality pet food. good brands are iams, eukanuba, hills, purina, etc. Also with a better brand off ood, and feeding less, your dog will make less doodies

-Jossie

['too crazy]

Eve, my vet told me the same thing Wolat said. It's not good quality food. I use Nutro Nature's best but there are alot of good foods out there.

[Eve_Ogrod]

Ronnie is now eating Nutro Max, which he seems VERY happy with. However, my hubby and I found it funny where it says, "does not include anything people don't eat" and lists chicken heads, guts, and feet. LOL! My family eats gizzards and liver all of the time (and we share my parents give it to their dogs). Guess they didn't check with us country folk...
Have a great day,
Eve

[DachshundDuo]

My vet told me that he has seen many dogs with Rickets as a result of being fed Ole' Roy brand dog food. Mine ate it for a while, but after he told me that I switched them to Purina and now Natural Balance Brand (which they LOVE).

[Magnum]

Old Roy is low on the food totem pole. Now this is strictly in my opinion and I strongly suggest anyone to do their own research as I did. The list of premium foods would be:
1. Natura (California Natural, Innova, EVO, etc..), Wellness & Solid Gold
2. Chicken Soup, Nutro Ultra, FRR, Precise, etc..
3. Nutro and Diamond

Magnum does awesome on California Natural!! His skin used to be dry and flaky and now it is slick and supple. I use to feed him Nutro Max and he did average on it. Had periodic episodes of vomiting and ate a tremendous amount.
Now, these premium foods are more expensive but..........
You will definitely feed less. Magnum went from 8-10 cups of Nutro to 4 cups of Ca. Nat. That is half the feed and Ca. Nat. cost me $3.00 more a bag. I Know I am spending less per month with a better quality food for him. :D

I would never have known myself if I didn't ask questions and do some research. Check out http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=home-tab
They have a comparison chart that is true to form and has been tested by non-biased nutritionalists.

[Wodkasibs]

Hi
I use a Lamb/Rice based dog food like Nutro or Natures Receipt. I know the cost is higher, but you feed less. Stools are better and after the next shed of coat, you will see a great different in coat and health. In a pinch I've used Pedigree and its not bad, but not great.
Sheila

[olbrent]

See my thread on homemade food I use only food available at the store, I feel it is far premium to any bag food, however I do feed Purina hi-pro after several weeks on mine just in case they do not get lots of hard bones to keep teeth clean. I try not to let them get any wheat in their diet as I feel it promotes hair loss.I own 4 happy healthy dogs, Thanks, Brent

[Kubrickgal]

I would never feed any of the following foods to my pets:
Ol Roy (one of the worst in my opinion)
Alpo (same quality as Ol Roy)
Kibbles N Bits
Gravy Train
Pedigree
Iams
Eukanuba
Science Diet
Bil Jac
Petsmart Brand
Nutro

Note: Nutro is the best of the aforementioned brands. It is an OK food, but again, I would not feed it and the way I see it, if it's not good enough for my pets, why would I recommend it to someone else?

All of these foods contain things I don't think pets should have and leave out things they should. Some dogs do well on Ol Roy and Alpo, but it's akin to those people who live on pizza and french fries and somehow die happy and healthy. It's unexplainable, really. But here are some brands I would suggest (note, all of these are going to be more expensive, but you should only have to buy once a month at the MOST)

Blue Buffalo
Royal Canin
Nature's Recipe
Innova
Wellness
Solid Gold
Diamond
Chicken Soup for the Dog/Cat Lover's Soul
Newman's Own
Pinnacle
Karma Organic (the most expensive but 95% organic ingredients)
Canidae
Eagle Pack Holistic
Back to Basics
Doctors Foster and Smith
Wysong
Natural Balance
Nature's Variety
California Natural
Active Care
AvoDerm

All of these are the top of the line. They are the healthiest foods in the world (there are more, but I can't think of them right now). In a nutshell, these are the things you NEVER want in your pet's food:

By-products
Corn
Wheat
Soy
Gluten
Sorghum
Sugar (sucrose)
Dried Beet Pulp (source of sugar, not good for pets)
Brewer's Rice
White rice
Vague fat sources (animal fat, poultry fat, etc-these do not tell you what animal the fat came from)
BHA
BHT
Ethoqyquin (BHA, BHT, and Ethoxyquin are all preservatives known to cause kidney and liver damage)

These are the things I like to see in pet food:

At least 2 proteins in a row as the first two, etc ingredients
Whole, unprocessed grains (whole ground brown rice, oatmeal, rye, barley)
WHOLE egg, not dried egg product
Vitamins and minerals (preferably cold-formed, not cooked. Heat destroys nutrients and by cold-forming veggies and fruits, they retain full potency for complete health-Blue Buffalo does this)
ONLY preserved with Natural Mixed Tocopherols and/or Rosemary

I apologize for the lengthiness of this post (brevity is not my forte). But I feel that paying more for a healthy food will provide your pet with all the nutrients he or she needs, keep them healthy and happy, and save you grief and money in the long run. Be careful t hough-healthy skin and coat are not definitive signs of health. They are important, of course, but just because they're healthy on the outside doesn't mean everything's well on the inside. Foods like Ol Roy and Alpo are usually damaging to the stomach, liver, kidneys, and frequently cause problems with anal glands and the rectum. I know this isn't what you want to hear. I used to feed my Pug Science Diet, which, although it is marketed as a great food, is not that much better than Ol Roy or Kibbles N Bits. I am sorry I ever fed it and glad I made a change. You will be too, trust me.

Again, as someone already mentioned, this is my opinion and what I have found through research. I strongly suggest you do your own before just accepting what any one person has to say.

[amanda622]

i feed my dogs nutro max and my dogs have gained weight and its healthy and its not too much money 30 pd bag for 29$ and they have large beed puppy good luck

[Dixonsdach]

I feed canidae, and used to feed chicken soup, both are great, and my dogs love them. My rescues get the same food too.

[Eve_Ogrod]

Thank you everyone! I think I'm going to stick with Nutro Max, Ronnie really likes it and he seems to be really healthy. Plus, a woman who lives near me helps with the SPCA and can afford any food on the market and she feeds her dogs the same thing.

Eve

[Podybears]

I feed my dogs Healthwise. I have learned through experience that the cheapest dog food is not the best. I do pay more for the good stuff but the end outcome of it all pays off. My dogs fur is supple and shiny and it has reduced the amount of food that I have to feed my dogs. I used to feed my 60lb Lab 4 cups of Purina One, and now I feed her 1 1/2 cup of Healthwise Chicken & Oatmeal. My dogs go to the bathroom about 75% less then before. It's because it has no fillers which they absorb the food rather then poop it all out. :rolleyes:

[Jerica]

I had been using Ol'Roy for my dogs, but after reading this post I thought about and had gotten Purina dog chow. How good is Purina compared to the others? I don't have much of a choice, I buy my dog food at wal-mart and all they have is Purina, Ol'Roy, Pedigree, Iams, and Kibbles n bits. When looking at those it seemed Purina was the best so I got that. Its only a little more expensive than Ol'Roy and less expensive than the others. What do you think?

[CTaylorsRott]

Purina does not offer quality food either. It is full of By-Products and Fillers. It is very important to learn what your dogs Nutritional needs are. Every breed varies in nutritional needs. The activity level of your dog can also change the nutritional needs. Kubrickgal listed great foods. Maybe you could check their websites. I feed Canidae and found a Shepherd Breeder that lives ten minutes from me that Sells Canidae. It costs around 34.00 for 40 pounds but it will last my two Rottie girl close to a month.

[Jerica]

Thanks, I am going to check out Nutra Pet Innova because it is all natural. I think a store here sells it so I'm going to see how much it is when i need dog food again. I do believe that Purina is the better of my other choices though because my dog is more active and doesn't seem to eat as much of it he also loves the taste. He is 10 years old and used to seem to have a little trouble getting up from naps and would hardly ever play, but now he is much more active. I don't know is Purina really that bad?

[Magnum]

Purina contains Corn Gluten as a cheap filler, Beef Tallow that does not contain the necessary nutrition for the skin and coat, Animal Digest which consists of non-human grade animal parts (yuck), etc.... Point is, Purina does not contain human grade products in their food at all, cheapens the food with useless fillers, and contains ingredients that are known to be allergenic in some dogs. I say " :p " on Purina for my doggies. :)

[bridgett81]

Ol Roy is NOT a quality food. Some dogs will do well on it, most could do better. I have heard (may or may not be true) that there are 4D meats in it, which are anything from sick cattle, to euthanized cats and dogs. Based on this, I will not feed it to my dog. Which is also why I add raw food to my regular kibble. I know where the deer meat came from, as well as the carrots and pears, etc.

[Pard]

I just adopted a retired racer and her previous owner had been feeding her a brand of food from Costco called Kirkland Signiture. I'm still feeding her that at the moment, but I've heard so many bad things about it. When I went back and looked at the ingredients list it actually looked OK. I didn't see any by-products listed near the top and it actually has lamb and rice (not brewers) listed as the top ingredients.

So, what's the deal?! :confused: :confused: I would really like to get all this dog food stuff straightened out, because I'm starting to assume that it's all the same.

Pard

[Magnum]

Hi Pard, Is Kirkland made bya company called Schell & Kampeter by chance? :)

[Pard]

Magnum- I'm not sure, where would I find that info on the bag? I only know that it's distributed solely by Costco. If you know anything about it please let me know.

[Pard]

One thing I will say for 'Ol Roy is that they have a beautiful label! It's like those old paintings from the fifties they used to put on paint-by-numbers.

Sorry, I'm an artist so labels matter more to me than they should.

[Pard]

Hi Pard, Is Kirkland made bya company called Schell & Kampeter by chance?


I actually just found a snippet of information that said that Schell & Kampeter do work with other "third parties" like Kirkland Signiture. . . is that a bad thing? :confused:

[Magnum]

Schell & Kampeter make the Diamond Products. Chicken Soup is considered one of their super premium food, and they also make Nutra Nuggets. Kirkland is made at the Diamond plant, but is a brand of Costcos. So, Schell & Kampeter make it, Costco puts their name on it.

I did some research on Kirkland and there are many manufacturers that make clothing, food, household items, shoes, all kinds of stuff for Costco. I haven't seen any negative feed back on the dog food, so that is great.

Best thing is to look at the label, check out the ingredients, and if that is fine and your dog loves it...heck, why not.... ;)

[PentePenguin]

I was feeding my puppy Nutra Max for a while until my husband and I fell on hard times, then I got him Ol Roy. It's fuuny because when I put him on Ol Roy his skin cleared up, he's a lot healthier, and his coat is really shiny. *shrugs* Maybe it's because he's a mutt?
Take care,
Dawn

[petpeever]

I have never seen or heard of Ol Roy. I do feed my dogs purina, never seemed to be a problem. They are healthy, people have commented on how nice Rex's coat is several times. Don't think I want to change now.

[PentePenguin]

It's WalMarts brand of dog food. The type I give Bubby looks just like Beneful and the ingredients were the same, or I'd be feeding him Purina, too. :)
Have a great day,
Dawn

[Miranda]

Another good brand of dog food that I feed my dogs is Flint River Ranch. It is available through independent distributors and is sent via UPS directly to your home. The cost of shipping is included in the price of the food. It isn't cheap but you feed your pet fewer cups per day so it doesn't come out to be that much more than the cheap stuff.

I buy mine through www.picnicpointpets.com.

The food is made from all human-grade ingredients. My older rescued dogs were having all sorts of health problems with their digestion and recurring ear infections. After I switched them the problems disappeared.

Old Roy & some of the cheaper pet food brands were found to be getting their meat from rendering plants which include the carcasses of dieased dogs and cats that have been put to sleep, road kill, rancid restaurant grease and other nasty stuff. Iams was found to be torturing animals in the process of testing their food. For example, taking out a dog's kidney to see if the food would keep a dog with one kidney alive and other worse, painful unnecessary things.


The Whole-Dog Journal http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/ publishes a top 10 list of the best dog foods every year and Flint River Ranch has been on it for the past several years.

[PentePenguin]

Old Roy & some of the cheaper pet food brands were found to be getting their meat from rendering plants which include the carcasses of dieased dogs and cats that have been put to sleep, road kill, rancid restaurant grease and other nasty stuff.

No offense, but if that were true it would be off the market. You can not kill an animal and put it in another animals food because of the fact it would transfer to that dog's blood stream and make it sick or kill it, too. I have read the ingrdients, it's the same thing as Purina Beneful, but a whole lot cheaper.
Take care,
Dawn

[Magnum]

According to the FDA, irradiation has been approved to be used on ingredients put in pet food to reduce the risk of contamination from the ingredient to the pet, as well as the pet food handler. This may help reduce the chances of cross-contamination, but I would rather be sure of the ingredients, instead of wondering what by-product is used. Listing the word "Poultry" can be any fowl, and can be any part of the bird, except the feathers because these, along with blood meal, are fed to calves and swine as a protien source. Ack!!

[JustJo]

No offense, but if that were true it would be off the market. You can not kill an animal and put it in another animals food because of the fact it would transfer to that dog's blood stream and make it sick or kill it, too. I have read the ingrdients, it's the same thing as Purina Beneful, but a whole lot cheaper.
Take care,
Dawn

Dawn,

You'd be amazed at what they can and do put in some commercial pet foods.

An excerpt from Dr. Belfied's article at www.belfield.com (he has been practicing for 30 years and was a veterinary meat inspector):

The condemned livestock carcasses treated with these toxic chemicals can then become meat and bone meal for the pet food industry. Worse yet, since rendering facilities are not government-controlled, any animal carcasses can be rendered, including those of cats and dogs. Eckhouse quotes Eileen Layne of the California Veterinary Medical Association: "When you read pet-food labels and it says meat or bone meal, that's what it is -- cooked and converted animals, including some dogs and cats."

Some of these dead pets -- those who were euthanized by veterinarians -- already have sodium pentobarbital in their bodies before being treated with the denaturing substances. In veterinary offices most cats and dogs are put to sleep with this chemical. According to Eckhouse, veterinarians at the University of Minnesota warned that the sodium pentobarbital used to put pets to sleep "survived rendering without undergoing degradation," but they concluded that the residue amount would be too small to cause problems if the carcasses of euthanized pets were mixed with other raw materials during a day's production run. No mention was made of the cumulative effects on a cat or dog from ingesting this small amount daily for years. Thus far we have come across the denaturing chemicals and the sodium pentobarbital, and I have only just begun.


From The Animal Protection Institute's site:

Animals that have died because of disease, injury, or natural causes are a source of meat for meat meal. The dead animal might not be rendered until days after its death. Therefore the carcass is often contaminated with bacteria such as Salmonella and Escherichia coli. Dangerous E. Coli bacteria are estimated to contaminate more than 50% of meat meals. While the cooking process may kill bacteria, it does not eliminate the endotoxins some bacteria produce during their growth and are released when they die. These toxins can cause sickness and disease. Pet food manufacturers do not test their products for endotoxins.

We now have animal protein classified as "4-D's", road kill and condemned material from the slaughterhouses. Another source of animal protein, which the industry vehemently deny they use, are rendered companion animals.

Dogs and cats euthanized at clinics, pounds and shelters are sold to rendering plants, rendered with other material and sold to the pet food industry. One small rendering plant in Quebec was rendering 10 tonnes (11 tons) of dogs and cats per week from Ontario. The Ministry of Agriculture in Quebec, where a number of these plants are located, advised me that "The fur is not removed from dogs and cats" and that "Dead animals are cooked together with viscera, bones and fats in 115C (236F) for twenty minutes." One large pet food company in the U.S., with extensive research facilities, used rendered dogs and cats in their food for years and when the information came to light "claimed no knowledge of it." The Food and Drug Administration, Center for Veterinary Medicine, in the U.S., is aware of the use of rendered companion animals in pet food and has stated, "CVM has not acted to specifically prohibit the rendering of pets. However, that is not to say that the practice of using this material in pet food is condoned by CVM." In a research paper from the University of Minnesota, entitled "Facts of Sodium Pentobarbital in Rendered Products", it stated that the barbiturate, sodium pentobarbital, which is used to euthanize small animals, "survived rendering without undergoing degradation."

In the U.S., as in Canada, the pet food industry is virtually self-regulated. In the U.S., the AAFCO (Association of American Feed Control Officials) sets guidelines and definitions for animal feed ingredients including pet foods. It is up to each State to adopt and enforce these guidelines. The AAFCO states that there are no restrictions on the type of animals which can be used in meals, tankage, digests, etc... Any kind of animal can be used including cats and dogs.


I read all I could on pet food when I got Bullwinkle due to the high incidence rate of bloat in Great Danes. I didn't know any of these things before and had been feeding my pets Pedigree. Once I started reading, I kept reading everything I could get my hands on about what goes in to our pets food. I wish had done this for my other dogs and cats before I got Bullwinkle but I say better late than never.

Go on the Internet and look around at different articles on the ingredients of pet food. You'd be surprised at some of the horrible stuff that goes into certain dog food brands. As a matter of fact, in 1999, a fungal toxin caused the recall of dry dog food made by Doane Pet Care, including Ol' Roy (Wal-Mart's brand) and 53 other brands. This time, the toxin killed 25 dogs.

My suggestion would be never feed any food that contains any "by-products", any unidentified "meat meal", and that the food is guaranteed to be made with all human grade, high quality meats, etc.


Jo

[Magnum]

You ROCK Jo!!! :D

[JustJo]

Thanks Magnum...you make me blush :rolleyes:

Seriously, I am horrified at what I used to feed my cats and dogs. I was feeding pedigree (but there are tons of others just like it) and here are the first five ingredients:

1. Corn
2. Meat & bone Meal (??? who knows? dogs, cats, rats, etc.)
3. Corn Gluten Meal (Great...more corn!)
4. Chicken By-product (beaks, feet, guts, you name it)
5. Animal Fat (what animal?) preserved with BHA/BHT (a known carcinogen
banned for human use)

Bullwinkle would need up to 12 cups of this "food" a day as an example. I think the price for a 35 lb. bag was around $16.00.

What they all eat now...Chicken Soup's first five ingredients (but all the way down the list is wonderful!):

1. Chicken
2. Turkey
3. Chicken Meal
4. Turkey Meal
5. Whole Grain Brown Rice

Bullwinkle eat 5.5 cups of this a day. It costs $28.00 for a 35 lb. bag.

Doing the math I am actually saving money by feeding my dog healthy, human grade dog food. This is where a lot of people get fooled by the pet food industry. It is much cheaper to feed a quality, albeit up-front more expensive food, than the store brands. They almost assuredly will end up costing you more in vet bills also with skin allergies and other long term poor nutrition results.

[PentePenguin]

I read what the by-products are and my family eats chicken livers and gizzards, these also get fed to our dogs. My mom's dog has lived 15 very healthy years on Pedigree and table scraps (mainly meat, poultry, aforementioned "by-products", butter beans, cucumbers, and green peppers (when she can't find a cucumber on the vine).

Here's my question, if it is so bad why are both dogs flourishing and leaving the vet scratching her head? Angel has never been sick from anything other than over-vaccination which was a former vets fault. I'm not trying to argue, I would just like an explanation before I go out and buy another bag of Nutro Max that made my puppy itchy. Now that he's on Ol Roy he's stopped itching, he's not sick, and was too skinny. He's 15 inches to his back and only weighed 16 ponds, now he's up to 24 and our vet's very happy with him.

I will agree to disagree, but I am closing with what I have seen and that is a lot of healthy and happy dogs living off of cheap foor living past their expectancy.

Take care,
Dawn
PS: I will readily admit that I am stubborn to a fault, too. :)

[Magnum]

:confused: Where'd my post go :confused: Dang, I put a lot of energy into that one.....lol. And with the flu too.

[PentePenguin]

I'm sorry your post got lost, I know how frustrating that can be when your healthy. I'm sure the flu makes it MUCH worse. :(
I hope you feel better,
Dawn

[JustJo]

That's okay to be stubborn Dawn. I am too - LOL! Some dogs I guess will do okay eating Pedigree. I don't know if I hurt my dog's or not by feeding them that and all of them did live pretty long lives, however, 3 of the 4 died from one type of cancer or another. Two were mixed and two were purebred shelties, so I can't say that it was genetics exactly. I do know that BHA/BHT is a proven carcinogen though and it is in the number 5 ingredient of Pedigree. One of the shelties died of heart disease at the age of 16 so I really can't blame that on Pedigree.

Jo

[PentePenguin]

Was it dry or canned? Those two eat canned Pedigree and dry cat food (when the cat leaves).
Take care,
Dawn

[JustJo]

I only ever fed dry to them.

Jo

[Magnum]

I was feeding Magnum Nutro Max and he also had the itchies with it and was throwing up quite often. I did my research on his specific breed (Dobe)and realized I was poisoning my friend... :eek: After looking at all the super premium foods, I decided to start with California Natural. I was astonished at his improvement. No itchies, has not thrown up once, his energy boosted quite noticably, and his coat is awesome.

No one kibble can meet the requirements of all breeds simply because not all breeds have a similar metabolism. Take a Basset and a Doberman........ROTFLMBO.....can you see a Basset keeping up with a Dobe, or a Dobe being able to lay still (without training) for 2 minutes awake.....lol.

[Magnum]

I'm sorry your post got lost, I know how frustrating that can be when your healthy. I'm sure the flu makes it MUCH worse. :(
I hope you feel better,
Dawn

Thanks Dawn.... :o

[bisquik]

Sure, some dogs do great on the Ol Roy type crap. But my grandfather is 84, in perfect health, and has been smoking for over 60 years. So should I encourage other people to smoke too, cause, hey it's really not bad for you?

What works for some dogs does not work for others. I feed my dogs a good, organic, human-grade food because it's healthier for them. Will it extend their life? Who knows. But regardless, it is healthier.

And I don't think the by-products she was referring to were healthy liver and gizzards. I've fed my dogs innards before too. But there's no regulation on it, sothe liver of an animal who died of liver disease can be put into dog food.

Lastly, I find it awfully suspicious that so many dogs are getting cancer nowadays. People too. And I think the main culprit is all the chemicals we ingest. What do you do everyday to the inside of your body that impacts your health? You eat. So I'd rather offer my dogs additive-free dog food.

[PentePenguin]

I was feeding Magnum Nutro Max and he also had the itchies with it and was throwing up quite often. I did my research on his specific breed (Dobe)and realized I was poisoning my friend... :eek: After looking at all the super premium foods, I decided to start with California Natural. I was astonished at his improvement. No itchies, has not thrown up once, his energy boosted quite noticably, and his coat is awesome.

No one kibble can meet the requirements of all breeds simply because not all breeds have a similar metabolism. Take a Basset and a Doberman........ROTFLMBO.....can you see a Basset keeping up with a Dobe, or a Dobe being able to lay still (without training) for 2 minutes awake.....lol.

How do you find that info? I'm not sure if it'll' be helpful with my puppy because he's so mixed. He's a Jack Russel, Border Collie, hound dog, with God knows what else thrown in for laughs. :)
Take care,
Dawn

[Magnum]

How do you find that info? I'm not sure if it'll' be helpful with my puppy because he's so mixed. He's a Jack Russel, Border Collie, hound dog, with God knows what else thrown in for laughs. :)
Take care,
Dawn

Having a mix of that many breeds can make it difficult to research. Realistically, feeding bi-products to any pet is really a shot in the dark as to what they are actually eating. There are fillers that are good to stay away from, such as corn, wheat, white pulverized rice, etc. If your pup's coat is shiney, he/she does not vomit (short of getting into a cat box....ack) , does not get ear infections externally provoked, doesn't scratch or get the itchies, has bright-clear eyes, enjoys what he/she is eating and not just eats it because that is all that is there, then that is really all you can ask for in a good kibble. Feeding a kibble that is used by their body, and not loaded with fillers, will decrease their stool output and food intake. Magnum went from eating 8-10 cups of Nutro Max a day, to 4 cups of California Natural. Before I started using Ca. Nat. I had to supplement his diet with Chondroitin, Maganese AA Chelate, and Glucosamine (liquid from the vet, 2 0z. a day). I don't have to do this anymore.

Now Bu Bair requires a different kibble. She is 14, low activity, and needs a kibble that will digest easier for her. She is on Innova Senior and is doing wonderful on it. If I was to feed her what Magnum eats she would get bound up, constipated (if I didn't supplement with Omega 3 & 6), and her health would definitely decline due to her age and activity level.

[JustJo]

Feeding a kibble that is used by their body, and not loaded with fillers, will decrease their stool output and food intake. Magnum went from eating 8-10 cups of Nutro Max a day, to 4 cups of California Natural. Before I started using Ca. Nat. I had to supplement his diet with Chondroitin, Maganese AA Chelate, and Glucosamine (liquid from the vet, 2 0z. a day). I don't have to do this anymore.


Exactly Magnum. That is one point I was trying to make. It is actually a lot cheaper to feed a high quality human grade dog food. More expensive up-front but cheaper by the intake amounts. And let's definitely not forget the output - LOL! Makes a HUGE difference with a Great Dane (forgive the pun).

Jo

[Magnum]

OMGosh, I can only imagine with Bullwinkle.....lol. Magnum is 100 lbs and his "output" was bad enough with Nutro....lol

[PentePenguin]

Externally provoked ear infections? Hmm, would that be like scabbies on the tips? :eek: It's funny about the potty/eating thing, he doesn't eat a lot either way but with both he has to go out every three hours.
Take care,
Dawn

[Magnum]

Sorry PentePenguin, I could blame it on this flu, but I can type some stupid explanations at times....lol. I was trying to say like an ear infection caused from dust, dirt, debris, mites etc....... ;)

['too crazy]

Don't forget your keyboard doesn't type the letter 'R'. :p :D

[Magnum]

Hey, keep it up Too and I will take the TP back.....ROTFLMBO!!!

['too crazy]

Oops, sorry. Here I have plenty. RRRRRRRRRRRRR rrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[Jennicat]

No offense, but if that were true it would be off the market. You can not kill an animal and put it in another animals food because of the fact it would transfer to that dog's blood stream and make it sick or kill it, too.

Honestly, as an agriculture student, that's a lie. Cows are routinely fed dead chickens, feathers, other cows (that's why we have mad cow disease). Chickens are fed on bloodmeal from slaughterhouses. I wouldn't place my bets either way about the byproducts in dog food.


Here's my question, if it is so bad why are both dogs flourishing and leaving the vet scratching her head?

I would say probably the same reason that some people can eat fast food all the time and weigh 100 lbs, and some people can look in the general direction of a McDonald's and gain 20. Different metabolisms, different dogs. Just because an animal CAN live off of that, and does appear to be thriving, doesn't make it an excellent food. As a child, I thrived off of a high candy diet.... ;)

[PentePenguin]

Did I say it was right for every dog? No. However, it does better for MY dog than the expensive food. So why would I make my baby sick again just because a lot of other dogs thrive on it?

The food for the farm animals here goes through regulations and is heavily monitored, so why would I think my dog's food wouldn't be? I've read the bag of food and it's no differant from Purina Beneful (as I pointed out).

It's a little irritating when people fuss at me for not agreeing with them, especially when the subject has already been dropped. So drop it.

Dawn

[bisquik]

The food for the farm animals here goes through regulations and is heavily monitored

:D :D

Thanks, I needed a laugh.

[JustJo]

I'm with ya Bisquik :rolleyes:

[Jennicat]

Ditto here, having spent six months being told the nutritional value of dead animal carcasses to chickens, cows, goats, and swine. :P

[JustJo]

Found something interesting on the web. Here is the site for the entire study. There are several dog foods listed but since this thread is about Ol Roy just thought I would post this:

http://www.ussvance.com/Vance/htm/pentobarbital%20in%20dog%20food.htm

In summary it is the Food and Drug Administration/Center for Veterinary Medicine Report on the risk from pentobarbital in dog food. The study was done due to veterinarians reporting that pentobarbital, an anesthetizing agent used for dogs and other animals, seemed to be losing its effectiveness in dogs. Based on these reports, CVM officials decided to investigate a plausible theory that the dogs were exposed to pentobarbital through dog food, and that this exposure was making them less responsive to pentobarbital when it was used as a drug.

Because in addition to producing anesthesia, pentobarbital is routinely used to euthanize animals, the most likely way it could get into dog food would be in rendered animal products. Rendered products come from a process that converts animal tissues to feed ingredients. Pentobarbital seems to be able to survive the rendering process. If animals are euthanized with pentobarbital and subsequently rendered, pentobarbital could be present in the rendered feed ingredients.

FDA/Center for Veterinary Medicine
Survey #1, qualitative analyses for pentobarbital residue
Dry dog food samples purchased in Laurel, MD, area, March - June 1998

KEY---Yes = confirmed for presence of pentobarbital
No = failed to confirm for presence of pentobarbital
No result = analyses failed quality assurance requirements
-Rendered ingredients:-AD = animal digest
AF = animal fat
BBM = beef and bone meal
BT = beef tallow
MBM = meat and bone meal

Ol'Roy Krunchy Bites & Bones
MBM(2) AF(5) AD(8)
yes

Ol'Roy Premium Formula with Chicken Protein and Rice
MBM(2) AF(5) AD(8)
yes

Ol'Roy High Performance with Chicken Protein and Rice
MBM(2) AF(6) AD(7)
yes

Ol'Roy Krunchy Bites & Bones
MBM(2) AF(5)
yes


I already knew this, just wanted to get some actual studies and statistics. Regardless of the questionable ingredients used, I certainly would not want my dogs ingesting phenobarbital.

Other brands that tested positive for pentobarb were: Nutro Premium, Trailblazer, Pedigree Meaty Chunks with Rice & Vegetables, Friskies Come and Get It, some Ken-L Ration Gravy Train, Kibbles And Bits, etc. Take a look at this study and see if your dog's food was found to contain pentobarbitol in this particular study.

They did test for cat and dog DNA in this study and did not find any. Presently, it is assumed that the pentobarbital residues are entering pet foods from euthanized, rendered cattle or even horses.

Jo

[PentePenguin]

:D :D

Thanks, I needed a laugh.

Alright now that was just plain rude.

[JustJo]

I don't know that Bisquik was trying to be rude Dawn. Everyone has their own opinions on dog food. This is, and always will be, a very touchy subject. Everyone has made decisions in this area that they are willing to take a stand on. You have said that you are stubborn and you are pleased with the results you have received with Ol Roy. It is your life, your dogs, your opinion and that is your stand. You haev already said that your dogs do great on Ol Roy but others may not. I have joined you in the "stubborn" area and have stated my opinion. However, this happens to be one of the hottest threads for newbies to go to and read what people's ideas are on dog food. I wanted to share my guilt and experience and what I have read on this subject in order to maybe help someone else's choice in the direction to what I now believe to be one of the most important things we can do towards our dogs longetivity and health. I know that we all agree on that as being our main goal - to have our babies with us as long as we possibly can. How we agree and disagree on getting there is the whole idea behind forums. I know that sometimes my hackles go up too, but then I try and remind myself that that is why we are here, to share ideas, opinions, and bounce things off each other. We will always have subjects we feel very strong on and will argue about (I try to keep the term "debate" in my mind) but in the long run I have never seen anything really mean posted on this site like I have on others. This is a great forum site and I personally would like to tell you Dawn that I am not judging you or saying that you are a "bad" person for feeding your dogs Ol Roy. You are happy with that choice and that's that. I would hope that you do not think that I am persecuting you in any way by stating my opinions on this thread. :)

Hugs to you...Jo

[PentePenguin]

No, I don't feel persecuted for that. I mentioned that animals food here is regulated and that was the response. I do not appreciate someone attempting to make me look foolish when (surprise, I do every once in a while :) ) know what I am talking about. I used to go to church with these farmers and my husband (mechanic) works on all of their stuff so I'm pretty well educated on farming practices in my area. I'm sure it may be differant else where, but I was talking about here in Page County, Virginia.

Now, about the food debate... :) I've got a good friend who does A LOT of work with the SPCA and I'm going to have her look at the dog food and give me her opinion. I would ask my vet, but we're on a first name basis, no office visit charge, type deal as it is because he sees me and Bubby so much.
Take care,
Dawn

[Magnum]

I've got a good friend who does A LOT of work with the SPCA and I'm going to have her look at the dog food and give me her opinion.

Great idea PentePenguin.. ;) Let us know what you find out!

[bisquik]

Sure, local farmers are great.

But corporate farmers produce the ingredients for the big name dog foods.

Do a little research, the farming industry is NOT as regulated as the USDA would have us believe. There are rules, sure, but what good are rules that are not enforced?

[petlover2004]

I have been feeding Life's Abundance food to my dog and my cat now for about a year. I also give them daily and coat and skin supplements. My dog's coat (a Cavalier king Charles Spaniel) has become very shiny and thick. My cat is like a different cat. She was a very solitary and somewhat unfriendly cat. Now she has become very affectionate and seems to just feel better. I am truly amazed . My daughter has a Sharpei who had skin problems for years. Her skin problems disapeared before she finished her first bag of food. I would never switch to any other food. Plus, the company claims your pet's life expectancy can be up to about 30 years with proper nutrition. See for yourself @ http://Healthypetnet.com/wesitpetsnj :D :D

[SheltieMom]

I don't suggest this type of dog food for any type of dog and this is my reason why. I was feeding Spring and Summer this food a couple years back and they'd been on it about two weeks when I started getting concerned because Spring wasn't using the bathroom easily. I called the vet to arrange to take her in the following day and it was at that time that she had an accident and went all over the floor (poop). I picked her up to clean her up and it was like the poop was all over her underside. I went to give her a bath and couldn't get it to come off of her. It wasn't stuck it was ... I can't explain it. I freaked out and called my dad (I'm still a daddy's girl calling him when problems arise lol) and he came over and the smell was just horrible.
He couldn't get her clean either, so needless to say I rushed her to the Emergency Vet and they had to clean her out. The vet asked me what type of food I had given her and I told her Old Roy and she said and I quote "No, no, no, no.. don't ever do that again!" It ran me a bill of over $300.00 and
a huge scare!! I had them at one time on Nutra Max for the specific breed but Lucky refused to eat it, so I have since found a dog food I prefer though I don't think it helps the coat as much as the nutro max did. It is easy for them to digest and I don't have a problem with my 4 eating it at all. It's Purina. I may change it in the future if I find a dog food that helps with the coat and still is easy to digest and has small bites but I don't know if that is going to happen.

[SheltieMom]

WOW! Petlovers2004 I'll have to check that out.
I'd love to find one that could help with all the little things including the big things. I am going to have to get something to help with their coats.
They are just getting duller in color it seems or maybe it's because it's winter/spring time and the girls are just getting their coats back in full swing again. I'll check it out! Thanks for the link.

[Katie18287]

I have been feeding our Newfies Purina for about 11 years now and never have had a problem with it. Our dogs like. I do agree that you should check out the ingredients on the dog food. We also give our dogs wheat germ oil for their skin and coat and a supplement I found while online one night called NuVet Plus. If anyone is interested you can find the wheat germ oil on the website www.wheatgermoilforpets.com and the NuVet Plus has a link on this site but you can also call them at 800-474-7044 to check this out. You would use order code 49949.
Hope this information helps someone!!!!!!!
Katie18287

[akhuskie]

I realize knowone here knows me from adam. But,the problem with grocery store and so called premium brands is whats going into the bag as far whats been done to the ingredients,ie;pesticides,other dogs and cats that have been euthanized,downed animals at slaughter houses,soured meat and so on. Even though some of those pratices aren't used as much but some still do.You can find out on the net if your food is one of them with some research. Purina One and Nutra Nuggets are probably the 2 best in quality as far as grocery store brands go. Ol'Roy is the #1 selling dog food in america or use to be. But hey, what do we expect from a nation that the leading health problems stem from obesity.

It dosen't take a brain surgeon to figure out that if a dog food cost $7- $10 bucks for 40 or 50 pounds it can't be that good. I use the analogy that macaroni and cheese or Ramen noodles taste good and you can live on it. But, you'd more then likely be overweight(diabetic),lazy,lackadisical,have a short train of thought,be more irritable and would prefer sitting in front of the TV then getting out and enjoying life on a regular bases. I would guess that at the very least 8 out of 10 people on this site and every site like it have pets with skin,hair,weight,allergies,ear infections,feet problems,yeast,and some with even worse problems and the list go's on.Animal health,nutritional care is big business.I have quite a few friends who are Veterinarians who say if it wasn't for people who buy cheap foods they'd go broke.

Just some "suggestions".The cheaper it is the more the dog has to eat to sustain its life,plus lower amounts of Vit/Min are used.Most of the diet is grained based and they use whats left that can't be used for anything else other then your dog food or it would have to be thrown out in the garbage.A quality dog food uses #1 grains not throw away.

Dogs do the best on higher meat foods with smaller amounts of grain.They will also consume less food and if you pick up after your dogs you will see a considerably less amount of poop and better consistancy/firmness.Just because its called a premium food dosen't mean it really is is the catch though.A good quality food will take care of skin and coat problems and give them a shiny healthy coat.But, some foods add synthetic ingredients to fool you in thinking there foods are all that because your dogs hair is shiny. If the food your feeding isn't doing some of these things and many more you might want to consider changing diets. But, remember changing foods alot isn't good either so do your home work for your pets sake and well being.Just because the dog won't eat it dosen't mean its not good some times. it could be be your changing foods to much.

Corn is not an evil ingredient. Low quality corn is.Corn has natural skin and coat conditioners in the oil as well as energy. Beet pulp is good for a healthy digestive system with the sugar extracted.