biting

[schavon2]

i've had my african grey victor for about 3 weeks now. he seems happy and well adjusted to his new home, eats a variety of foods, enjoys his morning misting, has a small repetoire of arabic phrases (we live in egypt), very alert, energetic. for the past few days victor has been lunging at my hand when i put it in his cage to change his food dishes. i suspect he has become territorial about his cage. how do i proceed with hand training him? how do i get him out of his cage? any advice about the biting?

[JSimko]

My advice is to talk to your bird as much as possible. You should tell him not to bite in a low voice. Also give you bird food from your hand whenever you walk past. It is not a good idea to force the bird out of the cage. In his own time he will develope trust for you.

[schavon2]

sounds like good advice. thanks all around. i do have a play gym for victor, but was hesitant to just leave his cage door open and let him come out on his own...i thought i was supposed to be the one who decided when he should come out, not him. i do give him food from my hand, both through the bars of the cage and with my hand in the cage, and he's fine with that. ive also read some posts about birds getting nippy in the spring, so that may be as issue too...although it's full blown summer here in egypt. ill try the play gym, and see if he's nippy there too.
thanks again

[schavon2]

i think i'd rather let victor come out and explore the play gym on his own as opposed to trying to grab him with a towel. im afraid that would make him even MORE leery of my hand, no?

[Amanda]

Schavon 2: When my lovebird started getting hormonal this spring and started to bite us, I started having her "step up" onto a dowel or perch. This is how I was able to move her from one place to another if I needed to. My lovebird knew the difference between my finger and the dowel because when I would offer my finger to her to step up on, she would lunge to bite. As soon as I offered the dowel, she hopped on it right away. Try to see if Victor is not afraid of stepping up onto a perch/dowel and once you can move him away from his cage, he might be fine.

Good luck and keep us updated.

[schavon2]

i'll see if victor won't come out onto the play gym on his own. if he doesn't, i may just have to 'towel or dowel' him!
the guy at the shop i got him from told me he's 2 years old, but i can't be sure. this being egypt, folks tend to tell you what they think you want to hear.
thanks for all the advice though. i feel better already knowing other folks have had this problem. i have wanted this grey for years, and will do whatever it takes!

[At_Ease]

I just had the same problem as "schavon2" with my Grey. He was biting me at every chance he could! May I suggest a video that helped me? Using the things that are talked about on this video, I was able to stop the bird from biting. It's $30 but totally worth it! http://www.BirdTricks.com I think that he put a post on here for the videos somewhere. I'm new to this site, and not quite sure where I saw it.... anyway, it was totally worth the $30!

Good luck!

Paul

[schavon2]

what are some of the things the video suggested? i live in egypt, and videos are hard to come by. even amazon dot com doesnt always get through customs.

[At_Ease]

It talks about ignoring the behavior. (This is going to be really hard to explain in text...)

Example: When the bird bites you, he is telling you that it doesn't want to be touched... if you pull away, he's rewarded. He got what HE wanted.

If you ignore the bite, and continue to pick him up, regardless of how much he tries to bite you, he learns that biting isn't going to stop you from picking him up.

Now trust me, I know that it hurts to get bitten by a grey!!! That's where the go into detail about a technique they refer to as "perching." Basically you have 2 dowels, one in each hand (about 12 inches in lenght, and 1 inch in diameter). You use one dowl to go to pick up the bird (once on a T-Stand). Then you kind of harass the bird by making him step up and down onto the dowels. If he tries to bite one dowel, don't let him, but don't pull away! Just go to touch him with the other one to "re-direct" his attention to the other stick, and forget that he was going to bite the first one.

It's really hard to explain, but the video explains it in GREAT detail! They show a macaw biting the guy, and show you in real time as he tames the bird down (just 10 minutes!). I hope that I helped a little. It's really hard to explain in text.

Paul

[schavon2]

i get the picture.
thanks.

[birdygirl]

Some books called parrot's off the perch and my parrot my friend are extremely helpful. They explain biting and why the bird bites, what to do about it.

[schavon2]

i wish...but like i said , here in egypt books and videos are hard to come by. i've just come back from visiting the family in the states, but didn't get victor 'til i got home (to egypt). had i known i was geting a grey, i'm sure there are LOTS of books i'd like to have bought. that's why this is such a great forum for me. great way to get advice from others more experienced than i with large birds.

[Squawksx3]

Im also having a biting problem with our Scarlet Macaw. We've had her for a couple weeks now and she bites to draw blood.... this is a BIG bird with a BIG beak.... yup, it hurts!. I dont think we will ever be able to handle her inside of the cage... she is very territorial, but we have no problem with her coming out of the cage. She is now at the point where she will get on my arm and just bruise me from her bites.. which is a great improvenment from bleeding LOL. We are letting her decide when she wants to be handled. It helps that our B&G Macaw and Goffin love to be handled and snuggle. The Scarlet will watch us when handling the other two and it seems to be helping. She's very smart. We are not familiar with Scarlets and are also reading up on their temperments and behaviors... Im also finding great info on this board :). We suspect there was a bit of neglect at her former home.

Best of luck with your Grey... I definately know what your going through!.

[crazeemama]

One thing i would like to mentions is that African Greys are very intelligent and easily bored. they need mental and physical exercise. Unless your bird is familiar with being toweled i would not encourage you to towel it. Greys are notorious for holding grudges for any impropriety either real OR imagined. Just go slow -let the Grey show you he's interested in being included. As Dr.Pepperburg has shown the model/rival method of teaching is very effective with greys.. they are so alert and curious they can't be 'left out' for very long. there is also alot of info on the web regarding clicker training for birds.
It is true with any bird, but especially Greys in that every action/interaction you have with the bird must be designed to build trust. If it does not build trust, it will destroy trust. So really thing about what the Grey will preceive your action to be.
Sitting on the floor near the cage and reading or talking softly seems to intrigue them.
Bribing with food helps esspecially at the start. what ever treat he likes, give it only from your hand and no other time.
at this time i would let him get on the play gym himself rather than ttoweling him.
You may find he is a little less aggressive once out of the cage too. hope this helps.

[schavon2]

THIS sounds like advice i can live with! thanks for taking the time. like that whole 'model/rival' method of teaching idea. makes sense, and seems to be more in keeping with victor's personality than toweling or forcing him out of his cage. i've been very cognizant that i don't want to do anything demeaning to or with victor. he's a magnificent bird, and i'd rather there be a sense of mutaul respect between us.